BrownTown on BrownTown. BnB audio engineer Kiera Battles is back with her behind-the-scenes insights on the podcast as the team discusses the episodes of 2023. Last year brought the continuation of the Whiskey and Watching series, a host of episodes surrounding the 2023 Chicago Municipal Elections, a resurgent discussion of #NoCopAcademy in the midst of the #StopCopCity struggle in Atlanta, and plenty of reflective conversations on the podcast, SoapBox at large, and the direction of the movement media ecosystem. For better or worse, here's to 2024!
BrownTown on BrownTown. BnB audio engineer Kiera Battles is back with her behind-the-scenes insights on the podcast as the team discusses the episodes of 2023. Last year brought the continuation of the Whiskey and Watching series, a host of episodes surrounding the 2023 Chicago Municipal Elections, a resurgent discussion of #NoCopAcademy in the midst of the #StopCopCity struggle in Atlanta, and plenty of reflective conversations on the podcast, SoapBox at large, and the direction of the movement media ecosystem. For better or worse, here's to 2024!
With 17 total full episodes, 2023 brought 15 guest episodes (6 repeat guests; 8 with 2+ guests), only 1 with no guests, only 2 virtual recordings, 6 series-type episodes, and 2 bonus episodes. In addition to the breakdown, BrownTown chops it up about recording in different locations before settling into the new SoapBox office, their favorite episodes, and their hopes for 2024. Originally recorded December 19, 2023.
GUEST: Kiera Battles is the BnB audio engineer and a music industry hopeful. Starting on the stage with choir and orchestra and later transitioning to life behind the scenes, music has always been with her. She began her audio journey during her junior year of high school as part of a vocational program to later get her BA from Columbia College Chicago in Interdisciplinary Studies focusing on Audio Arts with a concentration in live sound as well as Music Business. She continues to work in the audio and business side of the industry while earning her MA in Music Business at Berklee College of Music to later gain the tools and knowledge to start her own company.
CREDITS: Intro music from Clocks by Jahzzar; outro music from the hip-hop instrumental work of Bulasound. Audio engineered by Kiera Battles. Episode photo by Aidan Kranz. Listen to all the episodes on your chosen podcast application! For more information on the podcast, check out Bourbon 'n BrownTown on the SoapBox website.
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BrownTown on BrownTown. BnB audio engineer Kiera Battles is back with her behind-the-scenes insights on the podcast as the team discusses the episodes of 2023. Last year brought the continuation of the Whiskey and Watching series, a host of episodes surrounding the 2023 Chicago Municipal Elections, a resurgent discussion of #NoCopAcademy in the midst of the #StopCopCity struggle in Atlanta, and plenty of reflective conversations on the podcast, SoapBox at large, and the direction of the movement media ecosystem. For better or worse, here's to 2024!
INTRO
Music by
BODY OF EPISODE
[00:00:59.920] - David
I'd like to welcome everyone to another installment of Bourbon 'n BrownTown. It's your boy, David, coming to you from the Harambe Studios here in Chicago, Illinois. My boy C-Huddy, as some will know him, or Caullen Hudson for others. How are you doing, bro?
[00:01:20.910] - Caullen
For the IRS.
[00:01:21.860] - David
For the IRS. For the feds. They probably know you as C-Huddy, too.
[00:01:26.110] - Caullen
I hope so. They better. Jake, Jake from the feds. I'm doing okay. Doing okay. We're in that time of year where we're reflecting, whether we are trying to intentionally, and thinking through resolutions and all that. Or just for me, end of the month type shit. I'm not going anywhere for the holidays, I'm just here and thinking about the year that was passed and year to come. But I'm feeling okay. Just level-headed right now.
[00:01:53.300] - David
That's what's up.
[00:01:53.760] - Caullen
How are you doing?
[00:01:55.660] - David
I'm doing pretty good. I think I've been really grateful for the rituals that I have started establishing or started establishing with certain people. I think this type of thing for Bourbon 'n BrownTown, it's like a retrospective episode. I really started to appreciate those moments of allowing like, oh, I know this is going to happen, this will be the space where I can do just that. I've been really grateful for that. And so really excited to... And I think we were talking about this before we pressed record- but the fact that the three of us actually haven't recorded anything together in person, ever. It's just bringing back the memories of the start of the year, etc. But before we get any further, we'd love to introduce you to our special guest.
[00:02:44.720] - Caullen
Super special. The only way this podcast happens is because of Kiera Battles.
[00:02:49.360] - David
Facts.
[00:02:49.960] - Caullen
If you all don't know, didn't listen to last year's episode that recapped 2022. Kiera Battles is a music industry hopeful. Starting on the stage with choir and orchestra and later transitioning to life behind the scenes, music has always been with her. She began her audio journey during her junior year of high school as part of a vocational program to later get her BA from Columbia College Chicago in Interdisciplinary Studies, focusing on Audio Arts with a concentration in live sound as well as Music Business. She is now both working in the industry doing audio and business where she can, while also working towards her MA in Music Business at Berklee College of Music, to later gain the tools and knowledge to start her own company. And she does the audio engineering for B'nB.
[00:03:37.970] - David
Hey! And has been. How are you doing?
[00:03:43.560] - Caullen
Casually left that part out. It's okay. No shade, no shade. No, Kiera, how are you doing?
[00:03:48.500] - Kiera
I'm existing.
[00:03:51.250] - Caullen
Hey, existence is resistance.
[00:03:52.760] - David
Yo! But there's always moments and episodes, I think, where we may mention Kiera outside of your own episodes. But I think it's been really exciting to see your own development with us at Bourbon 'n BrownTown, so that's something that I did want to mention as we get started with this episode. Just thinking about looking back at what this year started with. Which, as you reminded us, was a virtual recording with you because we had just been recording at Let Us Breathe at the end of last year. And just playing it from there. And I think first few episodes were rather... We weren't releasing two a month as we usually had been. But with the first one virtual, and then we made the decision to start back at your place, right?
[00:04:42.110] - Caullen
Yeah, which was not a hard decision to make, but it's not ideal audio-wise. It's very open. Like I said before, we were at Let Us Breathe Collective, Black Liberation Space in South Side Chicago, we have homies at. But we recorded the end of the year episode that comes out in 2023. But I was out of town visiting family, and so that's how it started. There was a storm across the nation, and that took us away from being in our space. But then, I was trying to think back because I didn't notice in playing this episode, I'm like, Oh, we had an episode a month, maybe for three months. I was like, What are we doing? I think we were just busy.
[00:05:20.200] - David
Surviving?
[00:05:20.520] - Caullen
Yeah, I think to Kiera's point as far as existing, I think it was trying to figure out when we were going to move into our new office. I think it was just like, land the plane for projects in 2022. So we just didn't have capacity type shit. But on that, I think that was the first episode, Kiera, you were on with us.
[00:05:38.590] - David
Ever.
[00:05:39.900] - Caullen
So I'm just really curious what that was like for you?
[00:05:47.220] - Kiera
Mainly because it was done in my... Well, my part was done in my apartment. So the way my old apartment was set up, it didn't have complete walls. So my roommate, I had to make sure was quiet, and then my other roommate was not there. So I was like, We're just going to hope for the best. And luckily, we also did it at a time where the parking garage right next to us was not getting worked on by construction.
[00:06:23.510] - David
Blessings.
[00:06:23.700] - Kiera
Because- jack hammers, daily, up until about three o'clock. So it was just working against all of the elements of capacity and then location, and then environment. So it truly tested my ability to adapt and figure it out. And it also tested my ability to edit, especially because I do remember one of the issues with editing is both me and David's audio had bleeding from our headphones in the audio. So I was like, well, I'm going to sit here and figure this out.
[00:07:13.160] - David
Oh, my goodness.
[00:07:13.900] - Kiera
And hope for the best, especially because Caullen was like, is there echoing happening here?
[00:07:19.830] - David
You're like, fuck! Oh, my goodness. And what do you feel like the ending deliverable was like? Especially with you being in it?
[00:07:29.580] - Kiera
It was pretty good. I know, it was either my dad or my brother, because they ended up listening to it- and one of them said, I did not sound like me. And I was like, I also haven't been home in three years, I don't know what to tell you. Yeah, it was pretty good.
[00:07:45.980] - Caullen
That's so funny because I feel like normally... I guess I wouldn't say normally. In my experience, when I first started hearing my voice more, like, I didn't sound like me. And everyone's like, that's exactly how you sound, what are you talking about? No, it's all nasal-y and annoying.
[00:07:55.560] - David
You're like, Noooo.
[00:07:56.900] - Caullen
So that was funny they had that reaction. David, what about your thoughts on this beginning of the year in general? With B'nB, with Soapbox, with where you were at, I guess, as a person?
[00:08:07.340] - David
Yeah, to be honest, I think I was like, as we were talking about where we were in time. Dude, it was around the time... I probably talked a lot about this in 2023, but it was a time where I was tired of working out of my office in my house, and I wasn't productive. I was working out of Panera's and coffee shops and shit. I was actually really pissed off that we weren't in the office yet. I was just angry at the fact that the office just took longer for us. But I think I was grateful because I am trying to recollect of like, we had had the screening with HLAI for Seguimos Aquí at the National Mexican Museum of Art. That was January 30th, or yes, sometime in January of this year. And so that took a lot of effort and participation with even Sam, who ended up being a co-host with us this year. I'm just thinking about where I was in those first two months. February was my birthday, so I know I did shit. That turned dirty 30 for David. I don't know. Just really excited that we were able to still keep up.
[00:09:16.570] - David
I think I really appreciated us, who we started reaching out to. I think the one follows is the one with Hannah and that was cool because there was just still a lot that we left. I think that happens sometimes in some of our episodes where we didn't finish halfway through our podcast sheet, so to speak. I think just Hannah is so awesome and brings so much to that conversation. But then after that, we started bringing alderfolk. And I think that's where I think some of those electoral episodes, I think, which we've done. We've done, you and I specifically talking about that type of stuff. But it was exciting to bring in people who we talk about, to give them an opportunity to also speak their piece. Yeah, it's like a representative of the people.
[00:09:56.890] - Caullen
Yeah. We've talked about electoralism and people power and activism and grassroots and radical politics; it's been a thread throughout the show. But to me, 2023, there was a season of a lot of episodes where it was rooted in that in some capacity. Primarily because of the 2023 municipal elections in Chicago. That was one large bucket as far as progressive politics, actual leftist radical politics, and also electoralism, and how we dealt with that in various ways: with media, and having Morgan Elise Johnson on and stuff, and having electeds on before and after the election. Then even things with police abolition and the police district councilors who are abolitionists, and having them talking about this new reform structure in Chicago. If this is going to work? Abolitionists who agree, who don't agree, and that nuance. That was really cool to me. That was a large bucket I found.
[00:10:50.180] - Caullen
And also the bucket of, I wouldn't say resurgence, but we always talk about No Cop because the documentary was done, we were almost promoting the documentary and linking that with Stop Cop City in Atlanta. That was a bucket of really energy for us in general, especially at B'nB. Then at the end of the year, more recap-y style 100th episode. And then what is, I guess, in the global conversation around Palestine and what liberation struggles look like. When I was thinking about this year, those were the bigger buckets of things we've chatted about. But also, "Advertising in the Activist Resurgence" was the conversation, Hannah and "Politics of Fashion". Then I see those as similar trajectories of topics that are "not political": fashion, advertising; but are deeply political. Thinking on those threads was cool.
[00:11:43.310] - Caullen
One thing I like about these episodes is the stats of 2023. For ejemplo, we had 17 total full episodes. One episode had no guests, but every other episode did, which is unique. Fifteen episodes with guests, eight episodes with two or more guests.
[00:11:58.500] - David
I love guests, but go ahead.
[00:11:59.730] - Caullen
Six episodes of repeat guests, and some were repeats. They were first times this year, and they repeated later in the year, like Jessie Fuentes, shout out. Eighteen episodes with totally new guests, two are from Whisky & Watch. We had two episodes of the newer series, Whisky & Watching with the Hoodoisie gang- so obviously three folks with Charles our homey.
[00:12:18.210] - Caullen
I'm thinking of the physical recording of them. We had two virtual ones, one with folks from Atlanta, one with Kiera that we just mentioned, where we all were in different places- physical places. Other than that, I thought it was unique that we recorded in person as much as we could. Seven episodes were at my apartment, which is technically- at the time, was the legal Soapbox office type shit. Then seven were in the actual new office, which is where we are now, in Harambe Studios, shout out.
[00:12:45.410] - Caullen
Two were bonus episodes with no number to them. One was a promo for the No Cop Academy documentary. One was our first actual cross-post, the homies at AirGo/Respair Productions & Media. They asked us, Hey, can you cross-post this episode that we have that's pretty dope, that we feel really good about, "Help This Garden Grow"? And we were like, Sure, why not? And at first, we were like, We've never done before. It's weird. We're like, No... It was a time we weren't dropping anything. So we cross-posted, put that up there, got some listens, got them some new listeners and stuff. Our first time, probably won't be the last time, but that being a first for this year.
[00:13:22.490] - Caullen
Then we realized this when planning for the 100th episode is that we have different kinds of series kind of thing. And they're all a little different. Have our 2.0s, our 3.0s, similar conversations with different guests that we lean into. There was four of those. We had a 4.0 this year. I think that might be our first. One episode was a part two of the same planned conversation with Hannah. We didn't get done with that conversation, we had a part two. One was last year, one was this year. One was a vague similar topic with a coalition building at Stop Cop City. There weren't any sequential collabs, like a "We Are More" collective freedom project this year. Which is fine, but just like, Oh, I noticed that. It was very interesting.
[00:14:02.660] - Caullen
Those are the stats that I wrote down and thought about, and thought was interesting. But any of those stick out to you or the buckets of conversations we've had from the beginning of the year to now that seem meaningful?
[00:14:15.690] - Kiera
This year was the year I got sick. I don't know how many times. So it was mainly you all trying to navigate what I do and hope it came out well. I think the first time you did it, I just let you all do it without any instructions. And then I was like, okay, if this happens again, here's instructions. Especially at the beginning of this year, I had a full-time job. And that full-time job did not allow me to do anything at night. So Monday through Thursday, I was working 1:00 to 9:00 until they changed it to 3:00 to 11:00. And then on Fridays, I was working 11:00 to 7:00. And I was like, When am I supposed to have a life? At the time, I'm like, I'm 22 I should have a life.
[00:15:23.480] - David
Have more free time, at least.
[00:15:25.020] - Kiera
Had none. I even fell behind in classes because of that job. But when that happened, we all had to adjust to the fact that either it had to be super early or you all had to do it on your own. So it was mainly like, let's have everyone learn how to do everybody's job, essentially. Let's like, job swap. So it was seeing how those episodes came to be as we slowly got it together.
[00:15:59.452] - Caullen
Right.
[00:15:59.920] - Kiera
Because no one plans to get sick. And as my bio says, I work in the music industry, so close quarters and a lot of different people. So constantly sick. So it was just like, what do we do from here? And how do we prevent what happened the first time and continue building on that? But 2024, I do not plan on getting sick as much.
[00:16:30.380] - Caullen
#NoSick2024.
[00:16:33.290] - David
That's so real. That's so real. And then, Caullen, I guess to also answer your question, I think what I really appreciated was as we got things together... Because now I am thinking there was a few episodes where Caullen hold it down for us when Kiera isn't available- so shout out to Caullen. But I'm just thinking we started recording at Caullen's crib, and then we had our first Whiskey 'n Watching with The Hoodoisie. And that, in itself, was interesting because we didn't really know... We knew who we were inviting, The Hoodoisie- definitely check out their episodes. But who showed up to this space, I think was really exciting and I think really left for a really interesting episode. The film itself was nuts and- the Whiskey 'n Watching series, if you hadn't checked it out, please check it out- there's multiple episodes now about different films, et cetera, et cetera, and we plan to continue doing so. But I do think that Everything Everywhere All At Once with Ricardo and Charles and me, I think, really brought, for me, an excitement when looking at, not only are we media creators, but we're consumers. We're consumers of this shit, so how do we use our theory, put it into practice, and then develop shit like that?
[00:17:44.330] - Charles
[clip from Whiskey 'n Wathcing episode 92] I feel like What's not lost on me is that the mother saves the daughter from suicide. And her saviorship or her saving their daughter is informed by the politics of romantic love. She saw her husband, and he has this politics of, I navigate my life through positivity, seeing the bright side of things, being hopeful.
[00:18:08.650] - Ricardo
That's some reductive-ass shit. That's some reductive-
[00:18:11.320] - Charles
That's what he said, though.
[00:18:12.570] - David
We can't give everything to Hollywood. We can't give them everything.
[00:18:16.552] - Charles
Is that not a direct quote? Is that not a direct quote?
[00:18:16.750] - Ricardo
He's like, he's just a half glass, half full motherfucker. That's all.
[00:18:21.570] - Charles
But I believe in it. I believe in it. But he sees- he tries to see the loving aspect and tries to be kind, right? And I think even the simplicity of that is revolutionary. And the fact that that transforms her, and enables her to be able to save her daughter from suicide. Meaning that like, what, if she didn't have those politics, what would happen? You know I'm saying? If she didn't embody love, and practice kindness with her own daughter, what would happen? And we already know that answer because we see a reality; how parents and children's, and their interactions, and children going through depression and mental health problems.
[00:19:13.130] - Mia
I just think it's a trip that they had to give us this crazy ass film to really fundamentally internalize these concepts. Which is like, hurt people hurt people. And love is regenerative.
[00:19:15.920] - David
Welcome to Whiskey 'n watching, if it's your first time. [end clip]
[00:19:18.860] - David
I was really excited about that type of film and allowing that type of a space to happen at your crib. And then we had pictures on the rooftop because it was nice during that time making it. That was in the summer- it was like a spring time or whatever. That's something I'm thinking about, at least in the early years because-
[00:19:40.620] - Caullen
In the early years. It seems like forever ago. Thinking about the buckets of conversations, I'm thinking about that episode, I'm thinking about the election episodes and stuff.
[00:19:51.020] - David
And when Brandon Johnson got elected, it feels like forever ago.
[00:19:53.410] - Caullen
Yeah, and now we're like, Brandon, are you fucking up? You know what I'm saying? Which, we knew it would happen.
[00:19:56.720] - David
We're calling upon you.
[00:19:57.870] - Caullen
That's another episode. But it's like, it seems like, the election feels like forever ago because we knew everyone in our circles was throwing down. There was so much happening, so much narrative stuff to attack and struggle with and also uplift and things and whatever. It reminded me a little bit of, in 2020, in the uprisings, we had a police abolition episode, which is really popular. But other episodes that summer, they were about related with different stuff, everything leaned into the moment of uprising. And with a lot of episodes we had, and they were around election time, election season, even afterwards; they may not have been about the election specifically, but it was leaning into that a little bit. Even with Rossana and Jessie Fuentes, alderfolks in Chicago were like, Yo, let's talk about us being like, Latines and leftist Latines in city council. We're like, That sounds great let's fucking do it. And we did. And that was a little bit after the election, but it was still in that bag as far as, Okay, Brandon's in, we have a left city council, we have all these Black and Brown folks, lefty Latinas. We have this leftist and/soft progressive bloc, let's talk about it. Let's get into the weeds and talk about things, right?
[00:21:05.450] - Rossana
[clip from Progressive Latinas in City Council episode 97] On my end, I really wanted to have an opportunity to be here. Well, I like you both very much, and I love talking to you both. But the idea that you have two Latina queer women from movement who are changing the landscape of what the politics of the city of Chicago look like, electoral politics, I think it's something that just needs to be said, and people need to know it. So I think this was the best place for us to come talk about it.
[00:21:40.160] - Jessie
Yeah. I think- you know, there have been several articles that have come out about the LGBTQ caucus being larger, the progressive caucus being larger, but a lot of the publications lack nuance, lack personality, lack the ability to tell a counter narrative. And I think that Bourbon 'n BrownTown really provides that space. I mean, you guys are phenomenal hosts. Y'all understand the assignment. And it allows us to tell a narrative that I think in many other media outlets is very difficult to capture. The time is limited. The questions are targeted. It doesn't allow for the free space of conversation to truly allow for vision to be centered. But to also allow for the nuances to be captured. And so this space has been a safe space for me. In my last episode. I think it continues to be a safe space for folks like us. And, yeah, so I'm mad excited about this episode, but also future episodes that we get to engage in. [end clip]
[00:22:40.710] - Caullen
That was really fun. I'm like, Man, that seems like such a long time ago. It's just wild how the year goes. Then now, we're in this moment where all the things that we mentioned are still happening, but we have the asylum seekers in Chicago, we have this escalation moment in Palestine; we talked about it with Muhammad earlier, and that is coloring everything a little bit. David, on that episode, you even mentioned recording other episodes with ThoughtPoet or whatever, where the intro, we mention the moment we're in, we talk about something else. The moment that we're in as a globe or as a city, whatever, We always lean into a little bit, at least name it, we keep it going. Because unlike other podcasts, we don't record the next day, it's out type shit. Sometimes it's like, This is three weeks ago, but here's what we were feeling at the time. That's important. But also sometimes, man, it's been a month and the moment is past, how do we make sense of that now because it's so important? But there's that.
[00:23:33.740] - Caullen
I want to pitch to both of you, but in terms of where we record, when we've done virtual, we've only done when folks are out of town. ie: Stop Cop City, folks are living in Atlanta, or when I was in Florida at the time. Otherwise, we really try to have it in person, where folks live, at least in Chicagoland. I guess a leading question, why is that important, if it is? Especially now that we have our own space, which I love to show off. I think that's part of it, at least for me. But I'm curious where that lands with you all, as far as having a place we can go into, literally whenever we want. We don't have to go back and forth with someone about, Oh, can we use your space during these hours, please? We have money for it.
[00:24:20.280] - Kiera
Consistency.
[00:24:21.510] - Caullen
I felt that.
[00:24:22.800] - Kiera
On the editing side, of all the recordings we've done in this room, I know what the room sounds like, I know what's going to happen in the room. So it's like, okay. Especially if people are walking above us, and I'm like, I already know it doesn't pick up so I'm like, moving on. Just don't like, jackhammer the floor or something, I don't know.
[00:24:47.240] - David
Please.
[00:24:47.530] - Kiera
Please don't. But mainly having the ability to come to one place creates something consistent. Even when we were at Caullen's place, it was still consistent, but not as much as you would like it to be, especially when you could occasionally hear the train go by.
[00:25:11.650] - Caullen
I'd have to text my roommate, Hey, we're going to record during these hours, is that cool? You're working? You on a call? And he was like, calm, and he's cool, but it's also like, this thing I have to do to make sure.. Whereas here, it's like, this is our space, we pay rent here. This is our space, you can paint the fucking walls.
[00:25:25.880] - David
So for me, doing it in person, I think, has always been... I've always been super pro. And I think when we're doing it, at Caullen's space, to your point, I low-key like hearing the train go by, like low-key. It gave me that city-type vibe shit. And it's like, I'm also very biased to our own product. So there's definitely that. But I think as we got that consistency, as it was like, Oh, come here- there's a flow to it. I think that was really a perfect preparation for us in this space. And while Harambe Studios, we did the first episode with Rossana and Jessie, which was super exciting, the room had just been put together. I think from then on forward, I think I've been really grateful at not only people coming into this space and appreciating it as much as we do, but also making all of our lives a little easier in so many areas that I'm hearing. It alleviates stress from both of you. And on my end, it's not that I was ever stressed, but again, I get what I always wanted, which is to be with motherfuckers and be able to sometimes make drinks for folks or not.
[00:26:38.630] - David
Because I do think one thing that I hope we get better with is not recording in the mornings. Not that... Whatever, but if I had to choose something, I much love recording in the afternoons and evenings. I hear people also a little bit more like... And I know our alderfolk are out here working, but it's like, in the evening I think people are a little bit more chill, more relaxed. Like, I ain't really got nowhere else to go except home after this. I don't know. That's a mental note I've had when we've recorded the 17 episodes this year. Something I felt was when they were more in the evening time recorded, I felt like we got more like a mellow vibe. I think Justin was super cool, but I think that was just his vibe.
[00:27:17.330] - Caullen
Yeah, Justin, the homie Justin Stillmaker, he wears Hawaiian shirts all the time. I feel like you can't wear a Hawaiian shirt and be super serious.
[00:27:23.340] - David
Or pissed off about anything.
[00:27:25.190] - Caullen
Yeah! I'm glad you brought up Justin because I feel like the second part I'm thinking about is- the different types of series we have, some are recurring, some are ongoing- there's a part every once in a while, you'll see another episode, like Whiskey 'n Watching, like a 2.0, 3.0. Some we didn't have this year are back-to-back type shit. The part one, part twos are same combo, same person, just like, we just didn't have time to get all of it. But what I noticed that was interesting, I don't even know what this means to anything, but of the some kind of series we've had this year in 2023, a lot of them were some electoral radical politics-based. The one was with the 4.0 with Byron and Jessie; the "Narratives in Media & Documenting Movements", was cool with Morgan Elise Johnson. Because the impetus of that, the first episode was with Mateo Zapata, when he wrote that op-ed about Adam Toledo being killed and the Tribune being shitty about it. We saw that in the world and we were like, I want to talk to Mateo about that; that's just interesting as far as legacy media and stuff. Then we see Morgan on, I think it's WGN, coming at what's his name... Fucking-
[00:28:32.710] - David
Givin' it to him.
[00:28:33.860] - Caullen
Listen to the episode, The Homeboy. Older white man, conservative, he's like, *Brandon Johnson, he's a leftist, he's crazy*. I'm like, I wish. Anyway, we see that happens, and it's like, this is a moment, we know Morgan's a homie, let's have her on. Similar conversation and having a 2.0 episode was cool. And then the police abolition episode I mentioned earlier, that was 2.0 with the police district council because it's a new thing, it's a new structure. There's folks that we share ideology with who feel differently about it and it was nice to chop it up in real-time in a nuanced conversation about it. The thing I left with was like, It's an experiment. We're trying a thing. Let's see where it lands.
[00:29:13.210] - David
Yo, and keeping up with it. We're recording in late December and that episode, I think we definitely recorded in late June, early July. You know what I'm saying? To me, it's been really fun because what this always allows for me is, I make new friends, so I'm following new people. Just seeing what their worlds are like I think it's super exciting. And so, shout out to David and Ashley, who are also... They use their social media. I think they definitely were part of why that episode, I think, was one of the most shared episodes. Not only are people just curious about this thing that like- we're supposed to be anti-reform, but... I don't know. I think it was a good breadth of a conversation, I definitely encourage folks to peep that.
[00:29:54.650] - Caullen
Yeah. Like I said, it's one of our most listened to episodes this year, and there's-
[00:29:57.670] - David
I think it was the most shared episode.
[00:30:00.500] - Caullen
Oh, most shared?
[00:30:01.070] - David
Yeah. I'm trying to remember the Spotify Wrapped.
[00:30:03.470] - Caullen
No, you're right, I think that's how it was phrased. I think about our Spotify Wrapped.
[00:30:06.620] - David
Even though our most are Apple Podcast, but that's whatever.
[00:30:10.620] - Caullen
There is a gentleman in one of the places I teach fitness classes that he comes pretty often. And I know he's a police district counselor- I'm not sure what ward. But I was like, Hey, I saw on social media, you're a district counselor, as David likes to say, not police district, cause don't want to have police in the name; David O, the homie we had on. But he's like, Yeah, I listened to the episode with David and Ashley, it was really good. I really like... We talked about it briefly before class- I was like, Man, that's cool. Someone who maybe would listen to B'nB before, maybe not, but because the folks we had on hold his same new government position, he was interested in listening to it. I don't know this guy's politics, but I think they're more similar to ours than they are to John Catanzara. So... It was interesting to hear us talk about it in real-time, but I'm sure maybe David shared it to the district counselor group chat; I don't really know, but I'm all for it.
[00:31:01.260] - Caullen
I love the different kinds of series that we had. It wasn't until we were planning for 100th episode where I was like, Fuck, we have all these different types. I was like, This seems messy, which it is, but there's a reason for all of them, and it's cool to talk about it in real-time. But I'm curious, with those episodes- with the sequel episodes or ongoing series episodes, is there any of those that stick out to any of you all? Or something you learned from any of them that felt new or refreshing from that first part or second part in the series type shit?
[00:31:39.210] - Kiera
New in general was the concept of the alderperson. Because I'm from Ohio, we don't have that. All my life, I lived in Franklin County in Columbus, and Franklin County is huge. It's just one thing. We moved from one place; we live in a suburb now, technically, and we're still in Franklin County. So it was just like, I even had friends who are from Chicago trying to explain this whole thing to me. And then my roommate, who's from Texas, they lived in wards too, and I was like, I don't know what that is. What is a ward? And then for her family to also be from Louisiana too, and then still trying to explain wards to me. And I was like, What is happening? So it was just listening and learning what a lot of these people do. Especially with Ohio being just one flat slate of whatever.
[00:32:44.110] - David
Yeah. No, I'll definitely follow up on that in terms of… I mean, there's always learning, right? We mention that all the time. But I think I really appreciated having an opportunity- and having done this for a while now, this co-hosting podcasting shit, and having more courage, I guess, in a way, right?
[00:33:06.330] - Caullen
The cojones on this one.
[00:33:08.550] - David
But it's also who we were talking to, right? Not that we're ever going to bring someone in here to offer space for shit that doesn't need space.
[00:33:18.700] - Caullen
"Rittenhouse is right."
[00:33:19.450] - David
But I think- I've definitely been someone who I always like to try to piece it together as much as possible. And I think with the type of people who we had, to me, it was cool because I knew what an alderman was. But I only like, whether that was protesting outside their office or things like that- that was my interaction with alderfolk until recently. So it's creating those spaces, being a little more courageous, and really allowing myself that imagination with some of these conversations. Specifically the episode with David and Ashley. And others, because for example, the Morgan episode, I really appreciated about we understand that everything is biased. And having that understanding, Morgan was telling us about the inception of The Triibe and the purpose of that. And shout out to them that they're out here doing absolutely amazing work and it is an honor to just be in the same spaces. Because I think the ending goal for Soapox and The Triibe are the same. How we get there can be a little different. We use more film-oriented, while The Triibe definitely has a different focus. But that doesn't eliminate one from the other. And so that's something that I was incredibly grateful for.
[00:34:40.960] - David
And continuing to learn, but also just develop these stronger relationships as we went to it. And then having our space, again, I think just made us more- not official, but I mean, it felt... I don't know how much of this you remember, but it felt like we went from Genta's to Cards Against Humanity space. And then we started recording out of there. There was something about showing up, and you had a key card and shit. I don't know, it was like, Oh, just let us know- we'll let you in type shit. It was cool. I think we finally had that again, but to a whole different degree, where it's definitely something to be grateful for. Not only making people's lives easier, but also it's ours to do with. We're really excited about what 2024 can bring in terms of the potential of the space and how we want to share that with, not only B'nB and B'nB alums, but our community. And there's been different conversations. So I'm really excited at that.
[00:35:38.200] - Caullen
I think with having our own space, similar to Cards Against Humanity, as far as set up and professionalism whatever, it's like, Oh no, this actually is ours, we have all this. And to your point David, about having folks on who are at first nervous and feel more comfortable later on, it's like, Okay, we can do that not only through our words, as far as saying, Hey, this is a conversation. This is relaxed. We have this sheet we're planning, but whatever whatever. We can also offer water or a drink, or maybe have some snacks if you're hungry. Or like, Oh, someone came with you, they can sit outside and work on the WiFi. Or it's like, We can actually cater to folks' needs and wants a little more than we could before. Also, I'm thinking about when Morgan came and we recorded at my place, Morgan said, Do you have any tea? I was like, Fuck, I don't have tea in my crib cause I don't drink tea. But like, Soapbox can pay for tea for the office, and we can have tea for homies. Even something as little as that is just the extra thing we can provide for guests, which I really like and appreciate and I think speaks to a lot of it.
[00:36:39.670] - Caullen
And for me, as far as a learning in those sequel episodes and stuff, I'm thinking about the sequel episodes and the ones that were more electoral-based or whatever, which is a lot of them. But I also knew what an alderman was, but I also knew it was unique to Chicago, because my hometowns didn't have that. That was like, maybe three wards would have been Columbia type shit, sans students. And so I knew who they were, and with friends like Rossana and other folks who lean a little more lefty- progressives just because of organizing work. But in this moment, this year- even Brandon aside- which is changing as far as alderpeople being mini mayors and not; people are trying to shift that, supposedly. And so not only do we have to understand what they are on paper, what they have in actuality, but then how that actuality and that reality is "changing". I put that in air quotes. Potentially is changing, as far as what they do and how they manage their ward and stuff. I think everyone's learning in real time, including the alderfolks, right?
[00:37:42.910] - Caullen
Especially the lefty alderfolks who have more say and more power under this administration, but are trying to understand how to move with that. Then for us, being like, We're not in government and don't aspire to be, these are folks who we care about and share our politics, but also their seat matters in a certain; we want to challenge that seat no matter who's there. And doing that in love and stuff, but also in a way that's honest and transparent. And to your point, as far as having courage to, I don't wanna say challenge when we're like, challenge challenging Rossana and stuff. Like, we agree but-
[00:38:15.160] - David
No, but I'm curious. Yeah, like, talk to me.
[00:38:15.160] - Caullen
You're in the seat. Like, Hey, you're a homie- your colleague is a fascist, how do you deal with that? I couldn't do it. You know what I'm saying?
[00:38:21.670] - David
I'm being deadass.
[00:38:22.210] - Caullen
Those conversations, I think, are interesting to me; we were to have some of those in real-time, which was nice, versus after a thing already happened. What's happening right now? What's going on?
[00:38:32.450] - David
I really appreciate our ability to also like- we were able to go microscopic into Chicago, which is something that we hadn't done as deeply as we did. I think the biggest was prior years with the "Girl, I Guess Voter Guide", where we were able to dissect some of that information, which is what it starts off being. But I like the ability, the way we also brought it out to a national scope. I think you mentioned Stop Cop City. I think we mentioned throughout the year being able to go down there, hold space with folks from both the forest defenders as well as Stop Cop City. To then, talking about No Cop, again, we're bringing you back with the bonus episode with "Freedom". Which again is a national... While the campaign itself is over, the issue itself is national, and that's the connection with Stop Cop City. But then you mentioned our most recent episode, Palestine. And so I think being able to bring all of those things together. And Muhammad mentions in the episode of the work that the folks you just named and mentioned, the work they're doing in order to push forth a ceasefire in Chicago as one of the most biggest cities in the US. I'm just like, You can't write that shit. You can't write that shit. You know what I'm saying?
[00:39:52.890] - Caullen
The abolition bag came back strongly this year. It didn't go away over 2022, 2021; but I feel it came back this year with Stop Cop City with No Cop, with the doc being done, then with Palestine. I was scrolling through my Instagram earlier this week, and I saw a post I made when we had a No Cop Academy documentary screening at DePaul. In my caption I was like, "It's Fuck 12 from Chicago to Atlanta to Palestine." Then fast forward to October, November, December of 2023, it was like, Oh shit, Palestine- we're talking about Palestine all the time, always. There's a resurgence of movement from folks who've been throwing down for decades, but also folks who are new to the fight, new to the struggle. It's like, Okay, that was a through line that's always been there, but now it's heightened. And we have cultural artifacts in podcasts, in activist videos that homies are making. Shout out to Tom Callahan and Sensitive Visuals, like, Hey, here's what's happening on the ground, here's how to tap in. The abolition bag, as far as those being all connected, it was really interesting to me.
[00:40:55.960] - Caullen
And part of that, for me, that was cool was like, we had a bonus episode for #NoCoptober because we had all these No Cop Academy documentary screenings in October. I was like, Oh, this is a cool marketing thing, whatever. But it was one of the first episodes I can really think about that we made our own in-house promo episode. It was essentially a promo episode for No Cop.
[00:41:15.260] - David
We've kinda done that a little bit.
[00:41:16.290] - Caullen
We've done it before. It's kinda more after the fact.
[00:41:18.080] - David
Not so direct.
[00:41:18.850] - Caullen
But it was cool to be like, Hey, we can… Was it cool that South Side Weekly had an article about the screening stuff? Absolutely. But it was like, Hey, we are a film, media, branding entity, but also we can do that for our shit. It was cool to be like, Hey, this is happening- let's have a youth organizer on, talk about what it was like seeing himself in the film, shout out Freedom. But also throwing down in the campaign years ago, and also use that as a piece to get folks to come to these fucking screens and watch our movie. And just leaning into that 100%, and not having any qualms about it. That was kinda cool. The first time we did it at that level, which felt cool. I didn't think about it until after the fact.
[00:41:58.220] - David
I also think No Cop is such a unique piece as a documentary. I think it's our oldest running project. We have early episodes, Bourbon 'n BrownTown, with No Cop Academy organizers, at the time, when the name had just been created. Shout out Ruby for coining the "No Cop Academy" term. But you know what I'm saying? To me, it's like we had all these closing circles, but we had all these opening circles with terms of our space and shit. I don't know. I'm really excited about the potential for 2024 ever more.
[00:42:40.910] - David
Also, equipping the space with other things it needs. I think it's also cool when people come in and there's a level of respect to it that I think I really appreciated. Just because it's like, we don't... Soapbox isn't a podcast channel. That's not our end-all be-all goal. But I think we've learned, and folks have talked to us about, how important having the ability to get microscopic into some of these issues have been. Because again, we went from a local level to a national level; and I think what it just continued to highlight, whether that's with the "Water Solidarity" episode that we had with members of CDI and the Water Campaign here in the state of Illinois that looks at the hella- I think we're at +30 notices of violations at over 13 Illinois Department of Correction Facilities in the fact that their water is giving people diseases. People are coming out of jail with things that they didn't sign up for. There's a whole idea of like, well, they need to do their time. Cool, they do their time, but my man shouldn't be getting cancer because he did his time. You know what I'm saying, type situation. I think that's been such an exciting- and I think we dive into a lot of that in that episode. But you talk about abolition and all of it's aspects, I think that episode spoke to that. Because when we talk about our people who are incarcerated, we're not only referring to those who are innocent or who are there on bail. Also, I don't know if we ever gave it's proper funding, but bail has been fully... How do I want to say.... Abolished?
[00:44:15.440] - Caullen
No, abolished. Cash bail has been abolished.
[00:44:17.330] - David
Cash bail has been abolished this year. Shout out to the peoples at the Chicago Community Bond Fund who have been putting in years- and all the people part of that struggle. But talking about Ws, talking about growth, having the ability to have these microscopic conversations. Bringing it out, and getting people to fit in- to get in where they fit in, as we always talk about.
[00:44:38.050] - Caullen
One of the things we often ask on these recap episodes, which we should, what's your favorite episode? Which I'm curious about y'all, so think about it, put it in your brain right now. But I think one of mine, either my one I can say for sure, one of them is the "Coalition-building & Water Solidarity" with Avalon and Tommy. I think we mentioned in the episode Soapbox is a fiscal sponsor for the Coalition to Decarcerate Illinois, what David just mentioned. But for me, it was cool, who's not involved in that campaign intimately, seeing you all talk about it in real-time. Talk about abolition in general, but also with prison, specifically. Water as a human right. Then everyone brought something different to that conversation. Tommy showed up, how he did, and Avalon with her legal background, then tying the criminal legal system to white supremacy. Then David, you're talking about your role with Soapbox, but also how you organize with CDI, then me just asking questions, teasing out what abolition means in all these spaces. I just found so much breath and light in what everyone said. It was enough related, enough different. Yeah, I don't know. I think, not that my bar was low going into that conversation, but I think because I wasn't as involved in the campaign, I was like, Okay, I'm going to speak on my two cents in there, ask questions, and I'm going to leave it at that. But it was like, I really appreciated how everyone showed up, and it always stuck out to me.
[00:45:54.890] - Tommy
[clip from Water Solidarity episode 98] So, like Avalon- it was beautiful what you said, I think the necessity and urgency of abolishing prisons and everything that comes with that comes from the relationships or friendships I have with people inside. I haven't myself been incarcerated, but over the last decade, I've formed some of the people who I consider family to me are still locked up. I go on personal visits routinely with people who are in conditions where they're being poisoned. Like face constant violence, constant medical neglect. And I think, as I've experienced through proximity to my friends, like what my friends are going through and comrades on the inside are going through, I've also just tied it to the larger necessity of ending capitalism, ending colonialism. And how this shit is killing us all. The water crises that are inside prisons are accentuated because of the disposability politics of capitalism. You are vulnerable, so you get the worst, right? But it's also spread out everywhere. Capitalism and privatizing essential necessities is killing us all. [end clip]
[00:47:11.190] - Caullen
That kinda was in that abolition bag. Not as title-ized as Stop Cop City, or No Cop, but it was still in- if you want to get free, it includes water for everyone. It includes that building-up part of abolition as well as tearing down these carceral institutions. I really appreciated that episode for a lot of reasons. But not to get away too far from the point, but favorite episode for y'all. You can name a couple if you want, I'm curious where that lands.
[00:47:38.340] - Kiera
"Everything Everywhere All At Once." Because then I went home and actually watched it, and I don't like watching movies. It was hard to get through because of the length, because I don't like watching movies. But hearing it broke down further by people who do watch movies, and then the overall energy that was brought into the room.
[00:48:06.950] - Caullen
Yeah, it was a lot of energy.
[00:48:08.220] - Kiera
It started at a 10, stayed there.
[00:48:10.250] - Caullen
Ricardo, alone, is enough energy for everybody.
[00:48:13.050] - Kiera
It started at a 10 and stayed there. And then it allowed me also to talk about it in other spaces. Because I ushered at Jay Pritzker Pavilion all summer and one of their free movie days was Everything Everywhere All At Once. And people were like, I have never seen the movie. And me saying I only saw the movie because I sat there and listened to them, listened to you all explain the entire movie. And then everyone was like, Wait, you edit for a podcast? What's going on? They're like, What aren't you doing?
[00:48:58.460] - David
Kiera, too humble. Too humble. They too humble.
[00:49:01.750] - Kiera
Yeah. It allowed my work to continue spreading. Because everyone knows, I do a lot.
[00:49:11.130] - Caullen
The most, one could argue.
[00:49:13.420] - David
I would say too much. But alas. Youth.
[00:49:16.630] - Kiera
So it gathers all the thoughts. It's like, what don't you know about me to figure out what more could you learn?
[00:49:26.760] - David
Yo. You got to listen to Bourbon 'n BrownTown to learn all the deets. But, Caullen, I appreciate that question. And expecting it is still sometimes hard to answer just because I think from hanging out with the Hoodoisie gang to just everyone who we have had. And this is talking about from all the episodes. I think it's always incredibly grateful for people who show up and allow themselves to be vulnerable with us. But in that, I think that culminated in our 100th episode celebration. I think we had been planning it- it had been on the agenda for months knowing that the 100th episode was coming. I think it was originally slated for August of this year?
[00:50:12.350] - Caullen
Summer. No, [inaudible 00:50:12] earlier. Probably.
[00:50:13.400] - David
It was slated for god knows when, but we knew it was it. We were like, What is it going to be? And like, How are we going to do it? Just our producer hats on all around. The space started manifesting itself here at the Harambe Studios, and we were just like, Okay, no. Tagged in the correct people. To me, that probably is my favorite just because of, I think how it culminates. Again, everything and thinking, again, about these rituals that we set for ourselves. A hundred is a mark for other things; but thinking of, in that episode, I think I mentioned, I didn't realize it took us how many years to get to that. And again, not that it has to be a benchmarker that you have to time yourself to be like, Oh, you didn't do your first 100 in the first year, bro, what are you doing?
[00:50:56.290] - Caullen
That's not even- it's also, by the numbers, not what we do. Two a month, at tops, is not- you know. But, yeah.
[00:51:01.610] - David
Yeah, no, but benchmarks and others. I just remember being in that episode- or going into that episode because we had two different people be our co-hosts. We were out here celebrating. James was able to come through, too. I made little cocktails for folks. Everyone was having a good time. We're wearing Halloween costumes. It was kinda goofy. I remember it goes on social media and I had a cousin of mine hit me up and was like, Why are you dressed as The Riddler? I was like, You haven't listened to the episode? It's a Halloween costume.
[00:51:28.090] - Caullen
Read the caption.
[00:51:28.820] - David
But you know what I'm saying? I think it's like, and we argue- not we argue, but we talked about that, as we talk about every aspect of when we create the show. And understanding, again, understanding the responsibility that we have, all of us in this room, about what gets out into the world. So episode 100, I think, allowed one of the deepest types of reflections ever in the life and breath of Bourbon 'n BrownTown. We were able to hear from close members of our community who maybe aren't always seen with Soapbox Productions and Organizing say a couple of words. I was really touched by what we heard with Genta, which sat with me because he hasn't been with us for a while now. He helped get the ball rolling, so I was really excited to have that. It was cool because Sam was like, Oh, I'm so nervous. I think they did a fantastic job and really helped center it. And Camille brought that energy that we knew Camille was going to bring. I don't know. I think it worked out.
[00:52:28.540] - David
The 100th, for sure, was something that I really appreciated. I think really set the bar in my mind of how we want these next 100 episodes to look like. Being consistent in Bourbon 'n BrownTown, but also, again, we didn't have the space, we have full control over it. What are these episodes going to be looking like, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. That's what I'm feeling and vibing in response to your answer.
[00:52:54.200] - Caullen
Yeah, being consistent, but also trying different things, I think is something that sticks out to me. I think with the cross-post episode, "Help This Garden Grow" with AirGo. With the 100th episode and flipping the script and us being guests.
[00:53:06.630] - David
Yeah, that was cool.
[00:53:07.550] - Caullen
Helping whatever, also letting them lead and ask whatever they wanted to ask type shit. I'm curious and excited to see what that looks like in 2024 and beyond. I'm still down to experiment, try new things. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work, we don't do it again or we tweak or whatever. But I heard you say something about vulnerability, which is something we always try to forefront with guests, with ourselves in a way that feels good and safe to say whatever we want on the mic. But the idea with Sam and Camille, who aren't normally guest hosts, right?
[00:53:46.730] - David
Yeah.
[00:53:47.820] - Caullen
But with a ThoughtPoet of the world. When I think about Black masculinity and vulnerability and creativity, I think of him a lot because he owns that a lot and will tell you about his journeys, and we'll name names, and we'll talk about his experiences the past couple of years, especially. So it was a nice episode to just share space with him and just lean into those things, because normally, as we mentioned in the episode, if we're working together in a protest or something, we're just doing stuff. So it was cool to hear that from him in this zoom out to the broader context of Chicago music and movement and just creative life and how he's this Forrest Gump-esque figure in that the past several years. And so hearing him talk about that was cool and just how we think about vulnerable space and accountability in all the ways and contributing to harm but also being harmed and all that was big for me.
[00:54:38.630] - Caullen
I think part of what I didn't expect to come of that conversation was talking about the One Million Experiments documentary that he worked on with us. And thinking about the episodes we've had this year that were either with folks we've worked with, or will work with. And tying that to debriefs and briefs if we're going to do something in the future and how that important that is. Because we've been in situations where we haven't debriefed a thing, and then in the long run things have gotten messy. It's like, Oh, we didn't even debrief this or planned this initially. Maybe we didn't have time. Maybe we were in the moment, or maybe we did, and just didn't think about it. I was reminded with that episode and with the conversation we've had off mic as far as how important it is to debrief shit. In all relationships, really. But even these relationships, too.
[00:55:31.580] - David
Yeah. I'm piecing now every conversation that we've had. Then also just the follow-up with folks about when the episodes comes out it's always cool when people share it and stuff, but it's also interesting when folks actually have feedback and stuff in terms of what we're able to produce and opinions people have.
[00:55:53.520] - Caullen
One thing I will say, I think as we change seasons or change... New things are happening in our lives, professionally or personally, I think of the "Home" episode when you and I were talking just about, David, just having a home and what that looks like, but also coming in to this space. And that episode, we recorded at my crib prior to moving into the office.
[00:56:14.150] - David
We were closer than ever before.
[00:56:15.820] - Caullen
It was both future casting, how we thought we would feel, but also looking back on finding a home. We also made a macro to Bring Chicago Home legislation in Chicago, and houselessness and how that's manmade. These macro-level things we haven't experienced, luckily, but also understanding how that affects our people across the board. How do we center that with, what does having a space look like? What is being able to offer someone water at a place, at least you rent? How does that feel like? That felt vulnerable in a different way for us as well. It was at least centering back on ourselves a little more than we were with other episodes, especially with abolition, especially with the election- that was the only episode that was just you and I. That's always special to me, now, that most of our episodes have guests on them.
[00:56:58.800] - David
I didn't realize that that Home episode that we were… Because it was like, the photo is us finally in the space, but we hadn't fully been in there. I don't know. Just trying to start closing some of these things up in terms of having a space, I think it's not Bourbon 'n BrownTown related, but being able to also have an opportunity to share with our families, I think to me was really, really powerful in terms of being able to continue to show. I think for a lot of folks, maybe even some of our listeners here, they may not even really understand what Soapbox does.
[00:57:35.590] - Caullen
A lot of folks don't.
[00:57:36.520] - David
It's like, Oh, you all do a bunch of weird shit. Not a bunch of weird shit, but you all do a bunch of dope shit. I know you all make movies, and you all have a podcast, and then you're on social media, and then there's FAF , that's a thing! You know what I'm saying? There's all these types of shit, which I totally understand. But I think, to me, I think, again, having that home and celebrate it, I think has been definitely one of the high moments of my time with Soapbox, high time moments with Bourbon 'n BrownTown. Motherfuckers come in here and be like, Yo, this room is fucking dope. I'm like, Right? Isn't it? Having that sense of appreciation from folks the same way we appreciate it, I think is hella exciting. Hella exciting.
[00:58:12.750] - David
So I want to pitch to folks, what's something that y'all are hoping for in 2024 through Bourbon 'n BrownTown, but maybe also within yourselves? And maybe, Kiera, I'll pitch it to you first. But I'm hearing we got consistency with something that you love to see with Bourbon 'n BrownTown as we look at future episodes. We don't have a lot locked down for 2024 as of right now, so curious what you'd love to see from the gang.
[00:58:34.300] - Kiera
Mainly just one, continuing that consistency. Because I know one of the issues ended up on my end of just the level of...
[00:58:48.100] - David
Fo sho.
[00:58:48.410] - Kiera
Because we're figuring out the room and then everything was turned down. But then that made- when posting it, it turned it down more. And I was like, well....
[00:58:57.790] - David
You're like, Oops.
[00:58:58.530] - Kiera
But also we got to make sure the two hosts don't scream. They're right next to each other.
[00:59:04.370] - David
Tell them, tell them, tell them.
[00:59:06.710] - Kiera
So having more consistency, and continuing the consistency that currently exists.
[00:59:15.240] - Caullen
One thing I've been thinking about, I think I mentioned this on the 100th episode recap, was just having a built-in platform to talk our shit. Which B'nB has always been an element of, but it's like, there's been times we've been in meetings and like, Okay, we have the next episode with this person about this thing we were excited about, but after that, what's on y'alls mind? What's keeping you up at night? What are you thinking about? What can we do a little research on and chop it up in real time about, or have someone on who digs into this struggle, this campaign more so than what you're thinking about. Now that we have this space and have consistency- planning, will always be planning, we're all busy people, but being able to do stuff a little easier. I'm looking forward to be like, Oh, I'm thinking about this happened this week, I want to dig into this thought, process, or what would Fanon say about the asylum seekers? You know what I mean? And be able to hop and record an episode about something and put it out. Not necessarily for the sake of putting more stuff out, for the sake of just having "content", but just being able to have a space, a physical space, as well as this capacity and energy around making sense of our world in a way that is liberatory but is accessible. Which is what we've always done, but making that easier.
[01:00:37.120] - Caullen
That goes with zooming out- so like in general, as far as everyone making a little more bread and just having more time and energy that also makes being able to churn out... That sounds bad. Being able to carefully, intentionally produce episodes that are worthwhile easier. That's what I'm looking forward to, so I piggybacked on what Kiera said a little bit.
[01:00:56.330] - Caullen
As far as B'nB context, I think it also is a microcosm for our broader work at Soapbox and our lives in general. I just want more time and capacity to do all this shit. I haven't been physically out for Palestine yet, and I struggle with that. And there's reasons because of that- I'm trying to create my own peace and whatever, but also I want to go out and like... you know.
[01:01:15.300] - David
Fuck some shit up.
[01:01:17.130] - Caullen
Yeah, say Free Palestine with the homies. Muhammad had a beautiful story with the actions that USPCN has done. Which like, I'm not trying to get my ass beat by the cops, but there's some times that needs to happen- I don't know. I don't know. So love to have more capacity across the board, and with that comes being able to churn out some of these episodes that are worthwhile and fun and exciting. And I think are cultural artifacts that are a pebble on the long path to liberation.
[01:01:43.540] - David
Yeah. I appreciate y'all. And then listening to that, right? I mean, I've always been grateful for our flexibility. If we record one episode in two months, and that's what we got to do. You know what I'm saying? But I'm hearing that things are making easier. We're really excited to continue to bring in also just more capacity, more- other folks who are also excited about this work. And I think I'm really excited. I think we did that a lot this year, where we took ideas from other folks, right? Energies that other people bring in; they're like, Yo, what about this? Whether that's regular listeners, or people who are fans. I think that's something that I feel like I have mentioned.
[01:02:26.510] - David
But no, I'm definitely hearing both of y'all in terms of with the space, with more capacity, hopefully bring on more folk. I've really appreciated us, though, always being flexible and even now bringing in more ideas from other folk. Again, they could be long-time listeners or just fans, or they know Soapbox. There's been a case where motherfuckers know Soapbox. I'm like, Oh, y'all have a podcast? What about this? And we marinate on that. I'm really excited that with that consistency, it brings more episodes. And so ideally next year, you get 24 episodes from Bourbon 'n BrownTown. That would be our quota. And if you don't, we don't care. But I think it's cool in thinking of that's a potential that we have. We have 24 slots, thinking about it. What is it that we want to bring into space? And then other projects that we can bring out of there.
[01:03:17.220] - David
Definitely thinking of like, making it type channel shit. Not that this is going to be a Cards Against Humanity, per se, but I do think, again, the potential of this space. We're really grateful, again, to all of our funders out there, whether that be entities, whether that be individuals. Shout out to all of our monthly donors. Shout out to all of our one-time donors, to our Giving Tuesday people. Truly, this has been years in the making, and all of y'all are definitely included into the successes and the Ws that we all make, right? Because now we get paid. So that's nice, right?
[01:03:52.300] - Caullen
*grumbling* But I want more, y'all.
[01:03:53.590] - David
And we just- a little more, y'all, inflation is a bitch. They literally told us that they raised the price of eggs for no fucking reason. I think they just came out a couple of days ago where it's like-
[01:04:03.970] - Caullen
So if we just guillotine the corporate class, we'll be gucci.
[01:04:05.300] - David
I'm fucking saying. I'm say-ing! I guess that last part was mainly to our listeners, but you all have ideas, you all have everything. We see our socials. We communicate with y'all directly. But also a lot of the homies, shout out to everyone who has reached out to us directly in any way, shape, or form about anything Bourbon 'n BrownTown related. Because that's part of that growth, that's part of that work. Checking us when we need to be checked, but also inspiring and allowing for that feedback to develop and for us to evolve as we have been. I'm super excited. I did want to pitch it to y'all as we start wrapping this episode- we're looking at next year, is there anything, Kiera, we'll pitch to you first. Anything specific you're hoping for, personally for yourself in terms of 2024, or it's something that we should all be looking out for?
[01:05:00.250] - Kiera
I know I said it in our last meeting, but it's still true, having a consistent job and me not quitting jobs. I think I quit- it will be totaled at three jobs I quit this year.
[01:05:13.140] - Caullen
They keep trying you. They keep trying you! Y'all, Kiera's not to be tried with, okay. Don't try this woman.
[01:05:21.990]
[Tobe Nwigwe "Try Jesus"] Try Jesus, not me.
[01:05:27.280] - Kiera
I'm not in the mood. Leave me alone. I will check you an email, I don't care.
[01:05:31.400] - Caullen
Let's go!
[01:05:32.490] - David
My weekly check-ins are just Kiera just letting us know about how people are getting roasted left and right.
[01:05:38.660] - Kiera
Pretty much, and that's on them. But with Bourbon 'n BrownTown, going back to the 24 total, Kiera gets an intern. Because good god. I was like, I'm fine, it's fine. But I know at one point when I was editing, I had turned in three episodes in one go, mainly because I was on a roll. So I was like, let's get it done. But also it was one in the morning, and I'm like, what kind of monster am I? So I'm like, I get an intern.
[01:06:21.430] - David
Let's get Kiera of help.
[01:06:23.270] - Kiera
Give them some work, especially because a Masters is hard. And my classes are getting harder, especially as I get to where I'm going to start doing my culminating experience. Which I don't even know if other schools do that, but it's mainly your thesis to graduate. And I'm like, Y'all, I'm going to either disappear or we're getting help.
[01:06:55.050] - David
No, no. You heard it here first. You heard it here first.
[01:06:59.580] - Kiera
Like, she's been dark for months, what happened?
[01:07:01.550] - David
No, but we definitely appreciate all the work that you've done and how you've helped us grow. Really excited because you're really... What's the term I'm looking for? You are... What is it like?
[01:07:13.820] - Caullen
A nucleus?
[01:07:14.530] - David
No no no. You're not baptizing this place, but you are the first person to set the standard for how it is for the future.
[01:07:23.910] - Kiera
The blueprint? The OG? The what?
[01:07:26.370] - David
Sure, the blueprint. No, no, no. You're establishing a blueprint of what the system looks for for B'nB, you know what I'm saying? I think Genta did that in a way, shape, and form; through multiple spaces, you had that same experience, but it's like, now moving forward, it is a different level. We're asking different things of you, right? I think that's really exciting because you have never shied away from a challenge. I think that's something we definitely appreciate. Definitely, I always appreciate you being transparent with all the shit you're doing, and we appreciate that you find time to be able to do this as well, and how you connect it to some of your I think is hella exciting. Because that's probably why you stuck around. Because it just works out.
[01:08:06.890] - Caullen
Chi DNA was my master's thesis, as well as the Soapbox projects. How do I do less but do more at the same time?
[01:08:14.940] - David
But we feel it. Caullen, anything specific for you that the people should be looking out for in 2024?
[01:08:21.310] - Caullen
Everything I just named as far as goals and wishes for capacity and you're making more meaningful work that's easier on all of us. And getting to your point as far as you have an intern, just having more-
[01:08:33.820] - David
Support.
[01:08:34.070] - Caullen
Not necessarily making a huge team, but enough of a team that everyone has a role they can pour into that they have a skill set that's based with and they can get paid at the same time. I wanted that for all of our people currently and in the future. Personally, I think it's the same thing, I just want more capacity just to live and do things and be able to show up and go to an action last minute, not because I can, not because I have a million other things to do that have other priorities and whatever. I wish that for everybody.
[01:08:59.660] - Caullen
I think when we talk about folks who are struggling through these horrible systems when we have moments of movement and continuous movements, some folks either are fearful of tapping in or just can't tap in because they need to work all time or whatever. It's like, I want that freedom for everyone. I think that's what it means to truly be free. We talk about freedom and liberation a lot, and I feel like… I don't mean to use it so much where it gets watered down, it doesn't mean anything or it gets co-opted. But I think that's what it means to be free, to just do what you want for you and your people without having to be held down by a boss or a job or having to do something to make money just to literally live. It's crazy. We have enough resources and love out there that we should all able to do all the things all the time. It's just like, How can I get closer to that so I can pour in to other folks? Both interpersonally and in a relation level, really, really intimate level, but also make that broader for Soapbox, for B'nB in general. I feel like that's always my North Star in a way. I use that language very intentionally. On a macro level and a spiritual level, I think that's where I am in my life and my trajectory in B'nB and Soapbox.
[01:10:12.750] - Caullen
I'm thinking about next year in general, I think the world's always worlding. I think there's enough to think about and talk about and to do. But the primaries and election next year, as horrible as that seems, the DNC is in Chicago. So how do we engage or intentionally not engage with that in a way? And where will the... Seguimos Aquí is our brilliant half-hour film that we were still talking about. There's a new ED at ALMA, do we talk about that more? Do we update that to 2024 type shit? Israel is going to continue to be an apartheid state that's colonizing our Palestinian brothers and sisters and non-binary folks, and so how do we stop that, first and foremost? But also make sense of it for folks who were not thinking of it in the way that we feel like they should be. There's those things, too, where I'm thinking about the stuff we put out as Soapbox and B'nB, and how do we make sense of our world in a way that's uplifting liberation and life-affirming institutions and relationships that are loving. And then when they're not, we know how to deal with those conflicts on a macro level as well as an interpersonal level, which we're always struggling with. So the micro, the meso, the macro, that's always what's going on in my mind. Not diminishing the progress we've made, but also being clear about the goal.
[01:11:37.040] - David
We're just starting. We just got the space; a few episodes recorded in here. And to answer my own question in terms of 2024, I think I'm really excited to continue to dig roots with community members; finding new opportunities, new conversations, continuing to learn and show an evolution. Because we're allowed to evolve with new information, that's what's supposed to happen. I think, we ourselves, listening to our first episode, first three episodes, to listening to David now, 100 and something- I'm definitely really grateful for that growth and that evolution. I hope that I continue to be that same type of a sponge. Trusting myself, trusting our group, trusting the gang, but allowing things to truly bear fruit, I think, is hella exciting. For Soapbox, for Bourbon 'n BrownTown, 2024, we're on Michigan Avenue; I can walk my dog across the street, my guy, it's fucking awesome. And it's really grateful for, again, everyone who's contributed to us.
[01:12:54.250] - David
And we hope you all continue to peep. Because 2024, we definitely got a bunch of things going on. If this is your first episode and you made it this far and you are still not following us, follow all of our shit. Check out the episode notes constantly for all the details. If you don't even want to listen to the episode, just look at the episode notes you might learn everything without having to listen to the episodes. But the information is out there. We are grateful for everyone who has been a part of B'nB this year. That's how I'm feeling. Any last words for the peoples? Any last shoutouts for the peoples?
[01:13:30.880] - Caullen
Shout out to Soapboxpo.com/support. Y'all, we need that bag. We're in planning season, so the more we know we can get next year, we can plan more, we can prepare ourselves more, we can hire someone else, we can hire someone for Kiera for help. You heard her crying, saying she needs help. I don't know how the fuck Logic works or whatever the fuck you use to edit stuff, I don't know how that shit works. I'm not good at audio, so I can't do it, someone else needs to hop in. We joke, we kid, but seriously, those donations- you give $5 a month, it means something, and everything goes somewhere, and we appreciate that. And to David's point too, just like, follow, share, subscribe to the newsletter. We swear it's not super often. Even if we could, it wouldn't be. So just tap in. We care about this, we put a lot of energy towards it, we have sleepless nights. It's important to us. It should be important to you. Yeah.
[01:14:28.120] - David
That's what's up. Any last words for the peoples? Shout out to all of Kiera's fans. No, but as always-
[01:14:34.040] - Caullen
Are there names? Like a beehive? Is there like a Kierahive? Like a KB, KB hives? I don't know.
[01:14:40.620] - David
Thank you to our special guest for being with us. Let's see where 2024 takes us. And as always from the homies at Bourbon 'n BrownTown, stay Black, stay Brown, stay queer.
[01:14:51.300] - Caullen
Stay tuned, stay turnt.
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